repairing a power window motor



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Faulkner
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repairing a power window motor

Post by Faulkner »

I asked about finding a source for a replacement motor in this thread...

http://59sportfury.net/59forum/viewtopic.php?t=57

Alas, no nibbles, at least, no inexpensive ones. Last night I decided to remove the star gear on the end of the shaft, by gently tapping down on the shaft with two splints of wood under the gear; not only did the gear slide off, but the housing separated easily while I was tapping! (The long bolts had been removed.)

Apart from some inside rust, I can see that the brushes are in good shape; so's the field magnets and the armature. I'm thinking I can fix this puppy myself! The oil-impregnated bearings have lost their lubricant, and are binding on the shaft; I'll put some lightweight oil on these and keep them lubricated. And the commutator needs a good cleaning. But I bet it will run again!

The problem is further disassembly. The backing plate that holds the brushes appears to be pop-riveted to the bottom of the can. I'm thinking I'll drill these out, remove the armature from the assembly to clean the commutator, and reassemble using small bolts.

What do you think? Anything I need to watch out for, would you do anything differently? Any advice greatly appreciated... I think I'll take some pix as I go along.

Dan


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Faulkner
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Post by Faulkner »

Hmmm... Went to make indents in the rivet heads with a fine point punch -- so I could drill them out -- and they literally fell out! So the backing plate is free.

Still, I can't pull the armature out of the can. It spins freely, but it's almost as if there's a retainer holding it in the bearing. I don't wan't to pull on it too much -- does anyone have an idea about what could be holding it in place?

Dan


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rogerh
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Post by rogerh »

guessing: maybe a spring clip, though the purpose of that escapes me.
I wish I had some free time...I'd take apart one of my spare motors and play along with you..


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Faulkner
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Post by Faulkner »

Here's a great suggestion from Tom! Think I'll try it out tonight:
Tom Fox wrote: > -----Original Message-----
> From: Tom Fox [mailto:tom.fox@verizon.net]
> Sent: Friday, June 04, 2004 10:09 AM
> To: Dan Morton
> Subject: Re: [59plymouth] problems removing the armature from the power
> window motor
>
>
> Hi Dan, I don't think there is a clip on the end of the shaft. I remove
> one once by drilling a hole in the center of the end case and squirting rust
> cutter into the bearing. After a couple of treatments and a couple of days,
> I put a small punch through the hole and tapped it loose. Tom


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Faulkner
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Post by Faulkner »

Tom's suggestion was a good one. I drilled a small hole in the recess that holds the bushing, and dripped in some rust cutter, a couple of times. Then I took a punch, braced the housing, and tapped the armature out...

Voila! Out it came.

With the bushing still attached... :cry:

Image

Then I peered inside the can -- and what to my wondering eye should appear... :shock:

Image

Tom was right; there's no retainer for the shaft. But, there is for the bushing -- and with the bushing frozen to the shaft, the retainer took the hit.

You can see where I outlined one of the 6 tabs in red, that comprise the retainer for the bushing. In the center is the fragment of retainer containing 2 tabs. Now, here's what I propose to do, tell me what you think:

1) Clamp the bronze bushing between wood blocks in a vise, and after liberal doses of penetrating oil -- again -- attempt to tap out the shaft. (You'll note that the commutators cleaned up nicely.)

2) Remove the fragment from the can, clean it all up, place the bushing in the center, and pot the bushing in the recess with high-temp RTV.

I'm thinking that will keep the bushing in place, and handle the heat well. (There are circuit breakers in these motors, BTW.) What do you think about this idea?

Dan


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rogerh
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Post by rogerh »

excellent pictures and description of a rusty motor.
First you gotta get the bushing/bearing off the shaft. The woodblock clamp seems like a good idea. Be patient w/ the rustcutter!!
As for setting the B/B back in the unit with RTV, I have little exp with RTV other than BlueRTV, which I don't recall getting hard...maye the flexiblility will work to yur advantage. I wouldnt worry about heat...how many times do you need to crank up your windows?
Recently I used some epoxy putty on a project, which gets rock-hard, but then if you were just a teeny bit off, you would essentially ruin the whole thing.
Give it a try, Dan, if it fails, all you need is the base from another motor.

I am still fiddling with master p/w switch...the wires are so stiff, they essentially pull the terminal blocks off the switch contacts. So many times in and out of the door, now I've managed to break two of the snapclips, so the whole thing is held together with zipties and hangs from the door opening. I am headed to a WPC picnic, where I will adopt a forlorn look...maybe someone will take pity on me and offer me some parts/service/ another switch.
Roger


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tomf
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Window motor bushing

Post by tomf »

Hi Dan, I believe the retainer is there for assembly purposes, so it doesn't fall out, If you get the bushing off the shaft and free to turn, I would assemble the motor and not worry about the retainer. Once it's together, the bushing can't go anywhere. Sealing it with something may not allow it to self align. No retainment will make it easy to take apart again, in case it doesn't run the first time.......
Tom


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Faulkner
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Post by Faulkner »

So Tom, you think that once the assembly is back together, the bushing won't drift? I guess I could test that -- assemble, and try to wiggle the shaft. My concern was that the armature might come in contact with the field magnets if it drifted at all. I'll give it a try, and see how it goes.

Thanks
Dan


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tomf
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window motor

Post by tomf »

Seems like there was a socket that the bushing would sit in, on motors I have had apart, and the retainer just held the bushing in the socket. Could be your motor is a little different. Hard to tell from your photo. If you don't have the socket, then maybe you would need to use some form of material to build a socket to hold the bushing in the center.
Tom


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Faulkner
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Post by Faulkner »

I am sure now that you are right, Tom. I've removed the retainer fragments, and it's clear that there's a well for the bushing to sit in; when assembled, there's no reason for it to shift. And now, I have a convenient hole for routine oiling :P

Meanwhile, the bushing is soaking in penetrating oil. A first attempt at a light nudge didn't budge it, but Roger's right: Patience is the word here. A little more oil every day, and some vibration to work it in, before I bring out the big guns.

As far as putting the backing plate back in position: I'm thinking of picking up some thin cotters. I don't think they make pop-rivets that small; what would be ideal would be a plastic pin of some sort that I could cut and weld on the outside of the can, but I can't think of where I might get those. The hole is about 3/32" wide, I'd guess -- a little shy of 1/8". Any thoughts?

This sucka is gonna run again!

Dan


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Faulkner
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Post by Faulkner »

Faulkner wrote:Meanwhile, the bushing is soaking in penetrating oil. A first attempt at a light nudge didn't budge it, but Roger's right: Patience is the word here. A little more oil every day, and some vibration to work it in, before I bring out the big guns...
Yeah, well, I'm still not whackin' it. But it hasn't budged at all. Twice a day I soak it in penetrating oil, and tap-tap-tap...

Dunno. I guess I'll give it 'til the weekend, and then give it the gas.

Dan


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rogerh
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Post by rogerh »

have you tried the chubby checker(Twistin' the night away)
or the Beatles (twist and shout)?
Michael Jackson should be the last resort (just beat it)


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Faulkner
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Post by Faulkner »

Shake it up, baby!

Twist and...

No shouting involved! Or epithets, either.

It's off!

Dan


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rogerh
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Post by rogerh »

I asked a knowledgeable person about the RTV idea, and he agreed...it is not a strength issue...so go for it!


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Matthew Keij
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Post by Matthew Keij »

This topic is really handy for me. Maybe we need to do this too. How do you lower a rear window when it isn't going down with the p/w switch??
Another question. Our driverside rear window isn't going down with the switch there. It is going down with the switch where the driver sits (the master switch). What can this be??????


July 14th 2019 “the soul crusher”
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